Tuesday, September 7, 2021 [Tweets] [Favorites]

ProtonMail Turned on IP Logging for User

Natasha Lomas and Romain Dillet (Hacker News, 3):

ProtonMail, a hosted email service with a focus on end-to-end encrypted communications, has been facing criticism after a police report showed that French authorities managed to obtain the IP address of a French activist who was using the online service. The company has communicated widely about the incident, stating that it doesn’t log IP addresses by default and it only complies with local regulation — in that case Swiss law. While ProtonMail didn’t cooperate with French authorities, French police sent a request to Swiss police via Europol to force the company to obtain the IP address of one of its users.

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ProtonMail’s founder and CEO Andy Yen reacted to the police report on Twitter without mentioning the specific circumstances of that case in particular. “Proton must comply with Swiss law. As soon as a crime is committed, privacy protections can be suspended and we’re required by Swiss law to answer requests from Swiss authorities,” he wrote.

ProtonMail:

As detailed in our transparency report, our published threat model, and also our privacy policy, under Swiss law, Proton can be forced to collect info on accounts belonging to users under Swiss criminal investigation. This is obviously not done by default, but only if Proton gets a legal order for a specific account. Under no circumstances however, can our encryption be bypassed, meaning emails, attachments, calendars, files, etc, cannot be compromised by legal orders.

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Second, ProtonMail is one of the only email providers that provides a Tor onion site for anonymous access.

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Third, no matter what service you use, unless it is based 15 miles offshore in international waters, the company will have to comply with the law. This case does illustrate one benefit of ProtonMail’s Swiss jurisdiction, as no less than 3 authorities in 2 countries were required to approve the request, which is a much higher bar than most other jurisdictions. Under Swiss law, it is also obligatory for the suspect to be notified that their data was requested.

Robert Graham:

ProtonMail has always been clear: they abide by Swiss law and don’t track IP addresses until forced to. Now people are upset at ProtonMail because it works as claimed, not how people assumed because they weren’t paying attention.

Etienne:

[They] provided the IP address and information on the type of device used to the police

Now, of course Protonmail has to comply with Swiss law, but is that what you mean by “No personal information is required to create your secure email account. By default, we do not keep any IP logs which can be linked to your anonymous email account. Your privacy comes first.”

It was confirmed by @andyyen that in criminal cases, Protonmail can log IP addresses, their documentation say “in extreme criminal cases”

IANAL, but I have a hard time seeing how young people squatting buildings in Paris is an extreme criminal case. In any case, I have an issue with this lack of transparency from ProtonMail, if any police service can ask them to log IP addresses, that is not anonymous

Andy Yen (Hacker News):

Under no circumstances can our encryption be bypassed, meaning emails, attachments, calendars, files, etc. cannot be compromised by legal orders.

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Under current Swiss law, email and VPN are treated differently, and ProtonVPN cannot be compelled to log user data.

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Due to Proton’s strict privacy, we do not know the identity of our users, and at no point were we aware that the targeted users were climate activists. We only know that the order for data from the Swiss government came through channels typically reserved for serious crimes.

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We will be making updates to our website to better clarify ProtonMail’s obligations in cases of criminal prosecution and we apologize if this was not clear.

Gareth Corfield (Hacker News):

Today that boast has been replaced with a mealy-mouthed version: "ProtonMail is email that respects privacy and puts people (not advertisers) first. Your data belongs to you, and our encryption ensures that. We also provide an anonymous email gateway."

Regarding Yen’s first point, rogers18445 writes:

Each time you visit protonmail you re-download (cache can be invalidated) their client. It would be trivial for them to serve a specific user a modified client which uploads their encryption keys.

This problem is not specific to protonmail, any service which contends to be secure with respect to some server (the protocol relies on the client to decrypt stuff the server cannot) can be compromised this way because of implicit trust in the client software which can be modified at any time with no notice - making any auditing entirely meaningless in the case of targeted attacks.

Previously:

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