{"id":34934,"date":"2022-02-07T17:02:05","date_gmt":"2022-02-07T22:02:05","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/mjtsai.com\/blog\/?p=34934"},"modified":"2022-06-24T15:02:07","modified_gmt":"2022-06-24T19:02:07","slug":"the-danger-of-sideloading-chromium","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/mjtsai.com\/blog\/2022\/02\/07\/the-danger-of-sideloading-chromium\/","title":{"rendered":"The Danger of Sideloading Chromium"},"content":{"rendered":"<p><a href=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/ridiculous_fish\/status\/1490176831944740864\">Peter Ammon<\/a>:<\/p>\n<blockquote cite=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/ridiculous_fish\/status\/1490176831944740864\">\n<p>The sideloading debate is really about Chrome. Sideloading Fortnite is about money, but sideloaded Chrome is an existential risk, threatening to do to iOS what it has done to Windows and Mac.<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/ridiculous_fish\/status\/1490200231354327042\">Peter Ammon<\/a>:<\/p>\n<blockquote cite=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/ridiculous_fish\/status\/1490200231354327042\">\n<p>So many users live in Chrome and use nothing else. You may think that development is good or bad, but it&rsquo;s obviously undesirable from Apple&rsquo;s perspective, since it gives Google extra leverage over Apple&rsquo;s products.<\/p>\n<p>If your users live in Chrome, then you are at Google&rsquo;s mercy. You are dependent on Google to make any changes. Apple can add features like Do Not Disturb, but they&rsquo;re borderline useless if Chrome doesn&rsquo;t use native notifications, which for many years they did not.<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n<blockquote cite=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/ridiculous_fish\/status\/1490782070787903489\">\n<p>It&rsquo;s hard to find examples on the Mac side. But on iOS, it would be bad (from Apple&rsquo;s perspective) if features like Face\/TouchID web auth, Apple Pay, Pencil, iPad trackpad, etc. required Chrome support before any users saw them. That&rsquo;s the existential risk to Apple.<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/jensimmons\/status\/1490747578526404608\">Jen Simmons<\/a>, Apple Evangelist:<\/p>\n<blockquote cite=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/jensimmons\/status\/1490747578526404608\">\n<p>Gosh. Catching up with tech Twitter this morning and there seems to be an angry pocket of men who really want Safari to just go away.<\/p>\n<p>Do we really want to live in a 95% Chromium browser world? That would be a horrible future for the web. We need more voices, not fewer.<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n\n<p>Ironically, Apple believes that the way to ensure this is by only allowing one voice on iOS. In the short term, that probably <em>is<\/em> slowing the advance of Chrome, albeit by preventing Apple&rsquo;s customers from accessing certain sites and features. But this is depressing as a long-term strategy.<\/p>\n\n<p>Safari should not merely be good enough to keep iOS users from abandoning the platform in order to switch browsers. It should be <a href=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/mjtsai\/status\/1490770572455911424\">good enough<\/a> that Apple doesn&rsquo;t fear Chromium browsers taking over if users were allowed to choose. <a href=\"https:\/\/mjtsai.com\/blog\/2022\/01\/27\/notes-in-apples-password-manager\/\">Exclusive<\/a> <a href=\"https:\/\/mjtsai.com\/blog\/2019\/12\/11\/the-success-of-intelligent-tracking-prevention\/\">features<\/a> <a href=\"https:\/\/mjtsai.com\/blog\/2019\/10\/21\/safari-security-code-autofill\/\">help<\/a>, but they alone are not the answer. Users and developers both need better compatibility with the Web as it is, not as Apple wishes it were. I <em>prefer<\/em> Safari, but I can&rsquo;t always use it. If macOS restricted browsers the way iOS does, I would have to get a PC or run an emulator or something.<\/p>\n\n<p>Similar logic applies to the debate around Web apps vs. native apps on the desktop. The way to avoid a monoculture and <a href=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/ridiculous_fish\/status\/1490782967941111812\">get more native apps<\/a> is not to ban Web apps. It&rsquo;s to make it so that native apps can do more and work better, so that developing, distributing, and selling them is easier&mdash;so that users and developers choose them.<\/p>\n\n<p>To bring this full circle, I&rsquo;m not sure I want to know the percentage of people who buy Macs to essentially use them as really nice Chromebooks. Here the dominance of Chromium works to Apple&rsquo;s advantage, in a way, because currently Apple makes the best notebook hardware for running Chrome. But in terms of what&rsquo;s best for the Web and for macOS as vibrant platforms, I hope it&rsquo;s not satisfied with this outcome.<\/p>\n\n<p>Previously:<\/p>\n<ul>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/mjtsai.com\/blog\/2022\/02\/04\/app-store-external-purchase-fee-27\/\">App Store External Purchase Fee: 27%<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/mjtsai.com\/blog\/2022\/02\/02\/schneier-on-sideloading\/\">Schneier on Sideloading<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/mjtsai.com\/blog\/2022\/01\/17\/safari-15-indexeddb-information-leaks\/\">Safari 15 IndexedDB Information Leaks<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/mjtsai.com\/blog\/2022\/01\/12\/catching-native-apps\/\">Catching Native Apps<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/mjtsai.com\/blog\/2021\/07\/27\/safari-frustrations\/\">Safari Frustrations<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/mjtsai.com\/blog\/2020\/04\/17\/chrome-vs-safari-energy-use-and-compatibility\/\">Chrome vs. Safari: Energy Use and Compatibility<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/mjtsai.com\/blog\/2019\/11\/18\/the-hotel-cupertino-clause\/\">The Hotel Cupertino Clause<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/mjtsai.com\/blog\/2018\/12\/04\/microsoft-edgehtml-replaced-by-chromium\/\">Microsoft EdgeHTML Replaced by Chromium<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/mjtsai.com\/blog\/2013\/04\/03\/blink\/\">Blink<\/a><\/li>\n<\/ul>\n\n<p id=\"the-danger-of-sideloading-chromium-update-2022-02-08\">Update (2022-02-08): <a href=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/LeaVerou\/status\/1490813749460094981\">Lea Verou<\/a>:<\/p>\n<blockquote cite=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/LeaVerou\/status\/1490813749460094981\"><p>That is so awfully dismissive and tone deaf. No, people don&rsquo;t want Safari to &ldquo;just go away&rdquo;. People (of all genders!) want Apple to respect user choice and stop forcing everyone to use Safari on iOS whether they want to or not. It&rsquo;s pretty simple, really.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/DamienPetrilli\/status\/1490943052759789572\">Damien Petrilli<\/a>:<\/p>\n<blockquote cite=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/DamienPetrilli\/status\/1490943052759789572\"><p>If [sideloading Chrome being an existential risk vs. Fortnite being about money] was the case, Apple would have lessen the grip on the App Store to remove the pressure while keeping the &ldquo;only webkit engine&rdquo; rule on iOS.<\/p><p>That would have been a lot easier to win in court. Instead, they fight to keep all the money and the 27% in NL is a hint to it<\/p><p>&ldquo;Games account for approximately 70 percent of the entire App Store&rsquo;s revenue, and 98 percent of in-app purchase revenue.&rdquo;<\/p><p>If an alternative game store opened and made them lose all this money&mdash;as the App Store isn&rsquo;t competitive enough-pretty sure Apple would be pissed<\/p><\/blockquote>\n\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/ridiculous_fish\/status\/1490950109697540102\">Peter Ammon<\/a>:<\/p>\n<blockquote cite=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/ridiculous_fish\/status\/1490950109697540102\">\n<p>I think this is exactly what will happen. We already see it somewhat with the drop to 15% commission. Of course Apple will fight court rulings, but if my theory is right, side-loading is the hill they&rsquo;ll die on. We&rsquo;ll see!<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/jmfd\/status\/1490873256257400832\">Jonathan Deutsch<\/a>:<\/p>\n<blockquote cite=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/jmfd\/status\/1490873256257400832\">\n<p>Apple had serious insecurities what opening up might mean.<\/p>\n<p>They didn&rsquo;t want iOS to become the Mac, and they didn&rsquo;t want the Mac to become Windows.<\/p>\n<p>Control is in Apple&rsquo;s DNA.<\/p>\n<p>[&#8230;]<\/p>\n<p>Flash scarred Apple as a 3rd party causing the top system instability.<\/p>\n<p>There used to be openness voices that could push back before the EPMs took over. Now their worst instincts are  forefront.<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/lapcatsoftware\/status\/1491087810404696067\">Jeff Johnson<\/a>:<\/p>\n<blockquote cite=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/lapcatsoftware\/status\/1491087810404696067\"><p>Everyone whines about Chrome &ldquo;taking over&rdquo;, but nobody talks about how Safari had literally a 6 year head start over Chrome (January 2003 vs. late 2008\/early 2009) but was surpassed nonetheless on the desktop.<\/p><p>How did Apple let <em>that<\/em> happen? Looks like gross incompetence to me.<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n<p>And Chrome used WebKit until 2013. However, Google was able to massively promote Chrome using its own Web properties, and there&rsquo;s not much Apple could have done about that other than stop funneling users to Google Search.<\/p>\n<blockquote cite=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/lapcatsoftware\/status\/1491087810404696067\">\n<p>Why did Apple drop Safari for Windows? They ceded that whole market both for users and for web developers. Massive mistake.<\/p>\n<p>Where&rsquo;s Safari for Android?<\/p>\n<p>Google bothered to write a web browser for iOS. Apple did not bother, and then Apple whines about losing?<\/p>\n<p>[&#8230;]<\/p>\n<p>The irony is that Apple aided and abetted Google&rsquo;s dominance in a number of ways.<\/p>\n<p>Apple happily took Google money to make it the default web browser in Safari. Still does!<\/p>\n<p>Apple was a ringleader in the WHATWG coup to overthrow the W3C. Now a few browser vendors control the web.<\/p>\n<p>I would argue that iOS lockdown actually hurt Firefox the worst of the major browsers[&#8230;]<\/p><\/blockquote>\n\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/fimion\/status\/1491065664844738562\">Alex Riviere<\/a>:<\/p>\n<blockquote cite=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/fimion\/status\/1491065664844738562\">\n<p>There is no way to debug mobile safari on anything other than a Mac. This is a very high barrier of entry to debug slight rendering differences on safari.<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/elkmovie\/status\/1491092391633518597\">Michael Love<\/a>:<\/p>\n<blockquote cite=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/elkmovie\/status\/1491092391633518597\">\n<p>It&rsquo;s not just about web. App developers are subject to our own monoculture because Apple intentionally limits Safari to prevent web apps from competing with native + force us to the App Store.<\/p>\n<p>It&rsquo;s literally the Same. Exact. Thing. that Microsoft did with IE 20 years ago.<\/p>\n<p>If we&rsquo;re going to be stuck with a monoculture either way, I&rsquo;d prefer a monoculture built around open-source Chrome over one built around a proprietary app store and closed-source frameworks.<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n\n<p>See also: <a href=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/jensimmons\/status\/1491064075987873792\">Jen<\/a> <a href=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/nesl247\/status\/1491069572950401024\">Simmons<\/a>, <a href=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/_rschristian\/status\/1491114212789460993\">Ryan Christian<\/a>.<\/p>\n\n<p id=\"the-danger-of-sideloading-chromium-update-2022-02-11\">Update (2022-02-11): <a href=\"https:\/\/www.macrumors.com\/2022\/02\/09\/safari-team-asks-for-feedback-amid-accusations\/\">Hartley Charlton<\/a>:<\/p>\n<blockquote cite=\"https:\/\/www.macrumors.com\/2022\/02\/09\/safari-team-asks-for-feedback-amid-accusations\/\"><p>Apple has also been criticized for demanding apps that browse the web to use the WebKit framework and WebKit Javascript on iOS and iPadOS, a policy that effectively bans non-WebKit based browsers. This has caught the attention of regulatory agencies, <a href=\"https:\/\/www.gov.uk\/government\/publications\/mobile-ecosystems-market-study-interim-report\/interim-report\">including the UK&rsquo;s Competition and Markets Authority<\/a> (CMA), which said that &ldquo;due to the WebKit restriction, Apple makes decisions on whether to support features not only for its own browser, but for all browsers on iOS.&rdquo;<\/p><p>[&#8230;]<\/p><p>Following consultation with developers, the CMA is considering forcing Apple to reverse the ban on non-WebKit based browsers to allow for more competition. It is unclear if Apple&rsquo;s latest push for feedback is related to the growing regulatory pressures around Safari.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/brucelawson.co.uk\/2021\/set-safari-free\/\">Bruce Lawson<\/a>:<\/p>\n<blockquote cite=\"https:\/\/brucelawson.co.uk\/2021\/set-safari-free\/\">\n<p>The interesting predicate of this argument is that Apple intend to keep Safari as the sad, buggy app that they&rsquo;ve allowed it to wither to, because it has no competition. I emphatically do not want Chromium to win. Quite the opposite: I want Apple to allow the WebKit team to raise its game so there is an <em>excellent<\/em> competitor to Chromium.<\/p>\n<p>WebKit is available on <a href=\"https:\/\/en.wikipedia.org\/wiki\/WebKit\">Windows, Linux and more<\/a>. Safari was once available on Windows, but Apple silently withdrew it.  SVP of software Eddy Cue, who reports directly to Tim Cook, <a href=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/patrickmcgee_\/status\/1389632382244847623?lang=en\">wrote in 2013<\/a><\/p>\n<blockquote><p>The reason we lost Safari on Windows is the same reason we are losing Safari on Mac. We didn&rsquo;t innovate or enhance Safari&#8230;.We had an amazing start and then stopped innovating&#8230; Look at Chrome. They put out releases at least every month while we basically do it once a year.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>There is browser choice on MacOS, and <a href=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/tdp_org\/status\/1443527091681742850\">63% of MacOS users remain with Safari<\/a> (24% use Chrome, 5.6% use Firefox). As everyone who works on browsers knows, a capable browser made by the Operating System&rsquo;s manufacturer and pre-installed greatly deters users from seeking and installing another.<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n\n<p id=\"the-danger-of-sideloading-chromium-update-2022-03-09\">Update (2022-03-09): <a href=\"https:\/\/wormsandviruses.com\/2022\/02\/a-sweet-solution\/\">Jack Wellborn<\/a>:<\/p>\n<blockquote cite=\"https:\/\/wormsandviruses.com\/2022\/02\/a-sweet-solution\/\">\n<p>By going all in on JavaScript-based cross platform development, Microsoft has clearly decided to become Google before Google becomes Microsoft.<\/p>\n<p>So why doesn&rsquo;t Apple want to support progressive web apps? People assume it&rsquo;s just because progressive web apps would hurt App Store revenue. While I am sure that&rsquo;s certainly a factor, I suspect the App Store is the least of Apple&rsquo;s concerns. Like Microsoft, I suspect Apple sees progressive web apps as an existential threat. Unlike Microsoft however, Apple can&rsquo;t address this threat by completely embracing progressive web apps. At the end of the day, Microsoft can become Google because they are both software and services companies.<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n<p>See also: <a href=\"https:\/\/www.macrumors.com\/2022\/02\/25\/should-apple-ban-rival-browser-engines\/\">Hartley Charlton<\/a>.<\/p>\n\n<p id=\"the-danger-of-sideloading-chromium-update-2022-06-24\">Update (2022-06-24): <a href=\"https:\/\/infrequently.org\/2022\/06\/apple-is-not-defending-browser-engine-choice\/\">Alex Russell<\/a> (via <a href=\"https:\/\/news.ycombinator.com\/item?id=31858413\">Hacker News<\/a>):<\/p>\n<blockquote cite=\"https:\/\/infrequently.org\/2022\/06\/apple-is-not-defending-browser-engine-choice\/\"><p>Contrary to claims of Apple partisans, iOS engine restrictions are not preventing a &ldquo;takeover&rdquo; by Chromium &mdash; at least that&rsquo;s not the primary effect. Apple uses its power over browsers to strip-mine and sabotage the web, hurting all engine projects and draining the web of future potential.<\/p><\/blockquote>","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Peter Ammon: The sideloading debate is really about Chrome. Sideloading Fortnite is about money, but sideloaded Chrome is an existential risk, threatening to do to iOS what it has done to Windows and Mac. Peter Ammon: So many users live in Chrome and use nothing else. You may think that development is good or bad, [&hellip;]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"apple_news_api_created_at":"2022-02-07T22:02:08Z","apple_news_api_id":"6f814227-2bba-41dc-9925-22e8889bb974","apple_news_api_modified_at":"2022-06-24T19:02:10Z","apple_news_api_revision":"AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAEA==","apple_news_api_share_url":"https:\/\/apple.news\/Ab4FCJyu6QdyZJSLoiJu5dA","apple_news_coverimage":0,"apple_news_coverimage_caption":"","apple_news_is_hidden":false,"apple_news_is_paid":false,"apple_news_is_preview":false,"apple_news_is_sponsored":false,"apple_news_maturity_rating":"","apple_news_metadata":"\"\"","apple_news_pullquote":"","apple_news_pullquote_position":"","apple_news_slug":"","apple_news_sections":"\"\"","apple_news_suppress_video_url":false,"apple_news_use_image_component":false,"footnotes":""},"categories":[2],"tags":[91,412,31,2078,30,2077,103,2132,158,328],"class_list":["post-34934","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-technology","tag-appstore","tag-chromium","tag-ios","tag-ios-15","tag-mac","tag-macos-12","tag-safari","tag-sideloading","tag-strategytax","tag-webkit"],"apple_news_notices":[],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/mjtsai.com\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/34934","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/mjtsai.com\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/mjtsai.com\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/mjtsai.com\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/1"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/mjtsai.com\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=34934"}],"version-history":[{"count":18,"href":"https:\/\/mjtsai.com\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/34934\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":36341,"href":"https:\/\/mjtsai.com\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/34934\/revisions\/36341"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/mjtsai.com\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=34934"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/mjtsai.com\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=34934"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/mjtsai.com\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=34934"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}